Zogby poll--I'm not buying it

Zogby released new Iowa and New Hampshire polls today. The results are being discussed here and here.


In Iowa, Zogby has Clinton and Edwards at 24 percent, Obama at 18 percent, and Vilsack with 9 percent.


I am skeptical and I’ll tell you why below the fold.

By way of background, I was a precinct captain for Kerry in 2003/2004. When the polls looked bad for him in Iowa in the summer and fall, John Norris told the field organizers not to panic and to keep lining up precinct captains. The field organizers told us not to panic and to keep lining up supporters in our precincts. I hardly believed it myself, but toward the end when momentum swung away from Dean and Gephardt, we had the infrastructure to capitalize on that.


The first caucus I was old enough to vote in was in 1988, but it wasn’t until 2004 that I truly understood why they always say you need a good organization to win the caucuses. I think Edwards would have won if he’d had more precinct captains in place before December and January.


Right now I am for Edwards and I would lean toward Vilsack as a second choice–I can’t see myself caucusing for Clinton or Obama in any scenario. I don’t want anyone to accuse me of having a hidden agenda here.


I think the caucus system favors Edwards and Vilsack in a big way. Last I heard, a plurality of county chairs were for Edwards, and pretty much every active Democrat in Iowa who’s over 25 has already voted for Vilsack twice. Edwards and Vilsack will have a big edge when it comes to lining up the precinct captains who will turn out the voters in their neighborhoods.


Almost all of the people I know who caucused for Edwards last time are still for him–we know he can turn out a lot of people on caucus night. We know from last time around that he connects extremely well in the smaller communities, and with Ed Fallon supporting his campaign, I expect him to do well in the major urban areas too.


Obama is more of an unknown now. I think a lot of people are interested, especially given the puff pieces that appeared in various magazines over the past few months. But you need the hard-core voters who will show up on a January night to a location that’s different from their usual polling place.


I also wonder whether Obama  will be be able to put together the broad support you need to win a caucus. As you all know, whether I pack 100 or 500 Edwards supporters into my precinct caucus doesn’t change the number of delegates my precinct can assign. I wonder if Obama will be viable everywhere or if he will pack the halls in some areas while falling below the threshhold in other parts of the state.


Although we can’t tell this from the polls, talking with people in my neighborhood suggests to me that Clinton’s support is coming from casual political participants. These people may vote in general elections, but will they spend an hour or more of their time on a Monday evening? I’m a mom with young kids, and although I’d never miss the caucus, I’ll be the first to tell you it’s a hassle to work around mealtimes, homework, bath times and the bedtime routine. Young parents who are not highly motivated to vote are just not going to deal with that hassle.


I remember how frustrated I was when I couldn’t get a particular Kerry supporter to my caucus last time–she’d just had her third baby two or three weeks earlier, and while she would have stopped by a polling place to vote in a regular election, she was not going to drag the whole family out on a school night.


I literally do not know anyone who volunteered for a campaign last time (as precinct captain, canvasser or phone banker) who is planning to volunteer for Clinton’s campaign. And I know a lot of those type of Democrats in the Des Moines area. She’s got a lot of money, but I wonder if she will have enough volunteers to turn out the middle-class suburbanites she seems to be going for.


I also have serious doubts that Clinton’s campaign will fly in rural and small-town Iowa. I expect her to fall below the viability threshhold in a lot of places, whereas I expect Edwards to be viable pretty much everywhere.


Then there is the question of second choices. Do you know anyone who says Clinton is my second choice? If she’s not your first choice, she’s probably your last choice. I expect Edwards and Obama and Vilsack all to benefit from the supporters of non-viable candidates–maybe Vilsack most of all because everyone’s already voted for him twice.


What do all you politically savvy Iowans think? I just don’t buy the recent polls showing Clinton ahead here.

About the Author(s)

desmoinesdem

  • Infrastructure Advantage

    I’d agree.  Edwards and Vilsack start with the best advantage coming into Iowa. 

    The folks who caucused for Edwards in 2004 are probably joining the conversation as supporters who are leaning towards Edwards (or 2’s, right DesMoinesDem?).

      1) Definitely CANDIDATE X
      2) Leaning toward CANDIDATE X
      3) Undecided
      4) Leaning away from CANDIDATE X
      5) Definitely not CANDIDATE X

    As impassioned as the caucuses can get, it seems unlikely for there to be too much attrition from 2004 in the beginning.  So, Edwards starts with the advantage.  Here’s where the advantage ends:

    I think the vast majority of the respondents in these polls are 2’s.  It’s soft support.

    Additionally, we will probably see a different John Edwards in 2007-08 than 2004.  It’s a different country with different beliefs, so it would make sense to see some shifts.  The question is if his supporters stick with him as he changes, and if the soft supporters don’t stray for some other “rock star” or “rock solid” candidate.

    Vilsack’s campaign said they have 1,159 “1’s”.  It may seem small, but that’s a solid amount of votes to already have in the bank.

    • I agree, that's a lot of 1's to have so far out

      My field organizer told me that if someone signs a card pledging to support your candidate, there is about an 85 percent chance that person will actually caucus for your candidate. I don’t know where that number came from, but it seemed about right to me–we lost a handful of Kerry supporters I identified, but the vast majority who actually signed cards for me did show up that night for Kerry.

      I imagine that quite a few Edwards supporters are 2s, but I think a lot are probably 1s as well. I think that as he starts doing more events here again, people will remember why they liked him before and why they still like him.

      I can’t see any candidate touching him in rural and small-town and smaller-city precincts. Individually, those precincts may not have that many delegates, but collectively, they do. I just find it hard to imagine Clinton breaking 15 percent in those rooms.

      Vilsack’s strategy is definitely the right one, and I think his campaign has plenty of room to grow support here. I think he will finish ahead of Clinton and possibly ahead of Obama as well, but I doubt he will overtake Edwards.

      • Agreed

        I agree.  Right now, Edwards has the best of both worlds (existing structure and electability.)

        Iowa’s former Governor has the structure, but it will be a long time before we see a national poll that tests the elect-ability of Tom Vilsack (and he’ll probably be behind).

        The rest of the candidates currently lack existing activist structure (a.k.a. there aren’t a lot of Obama/Hillary/Biden/Dodd “1’s” out there).

  • Edwards' caucus advantage

    The Edwards organization is good and a definite advantage, but I think he would  have difficulty gaining much more support than he has. He will have to win Iowa to keep going as a serious contender.

    I agree Clinton is not favored by the caucus system, but it is hard to completely dismiss her at this point.

    But I think Vilsack just suffered a major blow today a the Obama rally in Ames. If the Treasurer and Attorney General have turned their backs on Vilsack and have endorsed Obama this early, then I think our former governor is in trouble. Slipping in both the ARG and Zogby polls spells doom, in my opinion.

    • I agree, Edwards needs to win Iowa

      I think NH is not natural territory for him, but if he wins IA, NV and SC he is in a pretty strong position.

      I think that when Iowans start comparing the candidates side by side, people will remember why Edwards caught fire in the final weeks of the last caucus campaign.

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